The Secret Ingredients of Effective Performance Management

Unlock the full potential of your company's culture with insights from Roxi Bahar-Hewertson, a maestro in the realm of leadership and organizational development. Together, we dissect the complex interplay between hiring practices and employee retention, deepening the conversation beyond surface-level perks. Roxi, with her wealth of knowledge, uncovers the precarious precipice where half of all new hires teeter towards failure within their first year and a half. We navigate the nuances of a company's inner workings, emphasizing how culture isn't just about diversity or a cool workspace, but fundamentally about how employees treat one another—a sentiment that resonates strongly even in industries where the bottom line isn't tethered to a paycheck, such as healthcare.

Performance management becomes a dance of numbers and narratives as Roxi and I investigate the balance of qualitative and quantitative measures in evaluating success. We stress the profound impact of feedback delivered right, steering clear from judgment and rooting discussions. The art of affirmation and critique, be it public acclaim or discreet guidance, is brought to light with Roxi sharing a method that doesn't just aim at performance enhancement but also at fostering growth and reducing resentment. Tune in for a transformative lens on leadership that promises to nurture a thriving team and a culture that exudes excellence.

Website: www.HighlandConsultingGroupinc.com

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Transcript

Laura : 0:41

Good morning. I'm your host, laura Wagenknecht, owner and CEO of Mosaic Business Consulting, and you're listening to the Mosaic Life with Laura W. A mosaic is a bunch of pieces that, when put together, make up the whole in a really beautiful way. This show plans to discuss the various pieces of a business throughout different industries and how these pieces, when put together well, can help develop a better, more efficient and effective running of your business. To reach me, contact bizradious.

Laura : 1:12

Today we have an amazing person, roxy Bahar-Huertzen, and she's been on the show before, so I don't know that we're going to go into too much detail about the past, but I do need to share with you her expertise, which is amazing. She has been a leader, a leadership expert, presence-based and ICF-certified PCC executive coach and organizational development expert, with more than three decades of practical experience in the worlds of higher education, business and nonprofits. She is the CEO of Highland Consulting Group, incorporated, and author of two highly acclaimed books, and I got to tell you right now, buy them, they are gold. One is Hire Right, buy Right A Leader's Guide to Finding and Keeping your Best People. And the second is Lead Like it Matters, because it does, and with a successful career focused on developing high performing leaders.

Laura : 2:17

Roxy is a foremost authority on helping executives and managers create thriving teams and work cultures that achieve stellar results. Her no-nonsense, practical, tell-it-like-it-is insights have graced the TEDx stage and been featured by premier media outlets. Love to hear that, because you've got to listen to her. She's amazing. She holds a master's in professional studies from Cornell University, where she served as an adjunct faculty in the School of Industrial and Labor Relations and as a senior administrator. She has worked with and coached leaders in technology projects and facilities, rapidly growing businesses, public and higher education, engineers and architects, healthcare professionals and more.

Roxi: 3:14

I'm pooped. So welcome to the show, roxy. It is great to have you here. Well, thanks, laura. I love being on your show and I love your show, so thank you for inviting me.

Laura : 3:21

Well, thank you, and you know, normally I do, you know, ask how you chose to go into consulting or go into coaching and that kind of thing. But I'm more interested these days given the fact that so many of the clients I'm working with are struggling with keeping, retaining staff or retaining employees and even maybe getting the right employees for the positions that they need, especially if it's a brick and mortar place where people have to show up, and so I'd love for you to help us understand, maybe, some of the foundation about hiring right and firing right, so that we have the right balance there. Hopefully, you never have to fire if you hire right, right.

Roxi: 4:14

That's right. Well, that's not always the case, but it's most often the case. Yeah, as I was telling you another time, it may take a little bit longer, but when you do the right things in terms of attracting and then interviewing, and then bringing on board and then doing the right things to retain your folks, you'll be miles and miles ahead. And it's a no brainer business-wise. I mean just a no brainer because the I mean who else, whoever on the planet, would accept a 50% failure rate, which is the national average On anything else? I mean it's, I mean that's, and that's a pretty low number for some people.

Roxi: 5:10

I mean this is, this is just reality is that with I'm talking within the first 18 months, there's at least a 50% failure rate in terms of whether or not you've attracted the right person, told them the right things and brought them on board the right way. So you know, I mean I can't think of a business person in any business profit or nonprofit, higher education, health care, any profession that would accept a 50% failure rate in anything else. So the fact that that's happening is pretty incredible to me. And you know, I mean I could talk to you all day about what you do differently, you know?

Laura : 5:59

I mean, I could talk to you all day about what you do differently. But where would you like me to start? Well, I'm thinking about one of the things that you and I were talking about briefly before, which was culture, and so often I think about that. How does culture fit into retaining employees, how does culture fit into the hiring process and all that stuff? But, more importantly, I so often talk to people who think culture has to do with DEI, diversity, equity and inclusion or that, hey, we've got this really fun office, but when it comes down to the real fun, it isn't fun, it's really working hard.

Laura : 6:40

And what does that mean? And, in particular, when you think about the healthcare field, where people are dealing with illnesses of people, other people and all the challenges that these people encounter on a daily basis, it's really hard for people to for, for owners of clinics and stuff to hold on to these employees because they can't necessarily give them more money and that isn't always the the carrot, if you will, for a person to stay. So if you could speak to maybe how that culture piece, like the vision and the expectations and things like that, how that fits into a person's staying, that would be great.

Roxi: 7:30

Well, I would start before they're staying. I would start when you're beginning to think about getting your position out there. Let me start here. As Peter Drucker famously said, culture eats strategy for breakfast, and culture is made up of many different parts. A DEI is just one part, but what really affects the culture is how people are treating one another. Period. It's about relationships and I'll tell you, people can smell the culture from a long way away. So you know what I mean. Even in a job posting you can tell. I mean that's one of the things I said in my book. I put two job postings together for the same job. One communicates one kind of culture and one communicates another kind of culture and, believe it or not, you know most people will go for the one that communicates a culture of welcoming, inclusion, of being treated with dignity and being allowed to learn and grow. So it's a complex issue.

Roxi: 8:38

I'm not going to try to oversimplify it, but I'll give you three questions that anybody who's thinking about filling a position and considering what the culture has to do with it, because it's like the air we breathe, laura, you know. Let me just give you an example before I go into the questions. So, for instance, say you go into, you know, a store that has and it always starts at the top, by the way the culture, and it always starts at the top, by the way the culture starts at the top. So so say, you go into a brick and mortar store and you don't see any employees smiling. You know you go to ask a question and maybe they know the answer, maybe they're helpful, but if nobody's smiling, probably not Right. Right, go into another brick and mortar store and people are laughing and they say good morning to you and they they ask you if you need anything. Or maybe they don't ask you because some people don't like being followed around if you need anything, or maybe they don't ask you because some people don't like being followed around. Whatever, it is the tone of the place. The second you walk in the door and, believe me, I'm not going to go to the store with no smiles. So the smile factor is a big indicator of the culture and I know that sounds simple, but it's true. It is true. Think of places you like to shop, think of doctor's offices you like to go to, think of which professors you might have enjoyed or teachers you might have enjoyed, versus the ones you didn't.

Roxi: 10:25

Once again starts with the leader, starts at the top. It is all about relationships. So now I'll get to my three questions that you should be asking yourself. Oh yeah, is that okay? Yeah, please, this is great. So imagine that you have a job to fill, whatever it is. And so here's a question to ask yourself what is your culture broadcasting to prospective employees before and during the process of hiring? And then, if you hire that person, how are they welcomed during their first six to 12 months?

Roxi: 11:04

Now, some people don't even don't even think about the first day. I mean, I, I can tell you, there were two jobs that I had where I had to build my own office. I mean it's crazy. It's like, well, just sit over there and we'll give it. You know, it's like, uh, try the job description. Here you go, bye, bye, no support, no welcoming, no learning about the organization. I mean it's just nuts what people do and expect somebody to stay.

Roxi: 11:36

Now you can be ghosted by applicants just because of how you treat them before they're hired. You can be ghosted by hired people because of how you treat them as they're being interviewed and as they're being hired. And then I, you know, I have the show up and leave people who come for the first day or the first week and then go screw this, I'm leaving and they do. And why do they do that? Because it's not a culture they want to be part of. You need to learn what kind of culture they want to be part of before you hire them and you need to be very honest about your culture. Okay, so my second question is how emotionally intelligent and this is a big deal when it comes to relationships how emotionally intelligent and competent is their immediate leader and supervisor in terms of leading and supervising, and how does that person impact his or her employees and then the culture within their responsibility pond or the area, that part of the organization that they have the most control over? So that's very important. Why do you suppose that's very important, laura?

Laura : 12:54

Well, if they can't pick up on, if the leader can't pick up on you're having a bad day or you're struggling in some way as an employee, then the leader can't address it and can't support you as an employee, and so then you feel like you're being dissed or ignored or uncared for, and therefore the relationship starts to sever a bit, wouldn't you agree?

Roxi: 13:21

Absolutely so. That reminds me that one of the most compelling human needs is that of belonging. And if I feel I belong in this organization or I don't belong in this team, or I don't, and say I was bullied in school, which happens to so many children, and then that we don't grow out of that, right yeah, we're just kids at big bodies, you know. I mean, we carry our childhood with us all the time. It shows up in coaching, it shows up in the workplace, it shows up everywhere.

Laura : 14:01

They take that back.

Roxi: 14:03

Yeah, really true. So so if, if I don't feel like I belong, why would I stay if I have it? So if I don't feel like I belong, why would I stay? Why would I come into work if I can work from home, virtually and not have to be part of a place that I don't belong any more than collecting a paycheck? So you know, belonging and relationships really matter. So here's my third question what have you done to make sure you have a culture where expectations are explicit? People don't do that. They forget.

Laura : 14:39

Oh goodness.

Roxi: 14:39

No, that is a biggie, it's a huge thing. They think. They think that they gave him a job description, that's fine. Well, that doesn't tell them anything. It doesn't tell them what success looks like. That doesn't tell them anything. It doesn't tell them what success looks like. It doesn't tell them.

Roxi: 14:55

I call it expectations and learning in the first triad of this, because if I'm expecting you to do X and I know that you've only done a little bit of X or you've never done X, then I have hired you with the understanding that you're going to get the learning that it takes to be successful. Exactly, expectations and learning have to be crystal clear. And then, for both new and current employees, how will success be determined and measured? So, what are the metrics involved? So, are you going to measure me on?

Roxi: 15:35

You know my behaviors. Are you going to measure me on my bottom line? Are you going to measure me on both? What are you going to measure me on and how? That is within my control, because if it's not my control, how can I be measured against it? It's like, no, it's like saying you know we want you to serve, solve world hunger, but um, you know we're not going to give you any resources to do that? Right, we're going to give you a nickel. Here you go, here, here you go. And then the third and last part of this, what I call an accountability model, is how are you acknowledging performance, whether it's good or not, and then either adjusting expectations or having conversations, all during this process that helps the person know what success looks like, how they can be successful, and that's really really important in terms of both qualitative performance and quantitative performance.

Roxi: 16:38

So qualitative, how they're behaving with the customer, how they're behaving with their co-workers, how they're behaving with their boss, what the values of the organization are and are they adhering to them. And then the quantitative. You know how many mistakes did I make? And if I made those mistakes, did we talk about how to correct them or did I get beaten up for it?

Laura : 16:58

So you know, you bring up something else too, which is did you get beaten up in public versus private? And then, did you ever get praised for what you did do right in public, not just private?

Roxi: 17:13

Well, it depends on the person First of all. Nobody should be in the period. They should be given constructive feedback and opportunities to improve. But it's not our job to fix people. It's our job to be clear with people and to be honest with people. But in terms of praise, you raise an interesting point. Now some people really appreciate public praise and other people would crawl under a rock before.

Roxi: 17:44

You need to know your people. So the Marines have a saying it's know your stuff. Let me see if I can remember it. Know your stuff, know your people. And there's a third one and I can't remember it off the top of my head, but it's the know your people part is so critical. You know, you need to know whether or not this person so situational leadership Ken Blanchard's work, situational leadership is really about understanding where that person is in their learning curve about X, y or Z, yes, need or don't need. Really, how you treat people in the workplace, if you treat them with respect and dignity, they're far more likely to stay than if you're berating them privately or publicly. That doesn't mean you don't give them constructive feedback. But constructive feedback, by the way, is just information. It could be about constructive feedback about how well somebody did and being very specific to that and what the impact was, and encouraging them to do it more. It can be about something that they did that isn't working and helping them understand why it isn't working, and so forth.

Laura : 19:04

But I think you bring up something really critical there which I think most people struggle with is how do you develop that leadership skill that doesn't have judgment behind it, that has facts that support their decision-making and their approach to things, and then facts that lead them in a particular direction or not right. It's so hard to, because praising or even giving constructive criticism in essence seems like it's judgment. But in fact, if judgment is withheld from the person you know the person who's giving this information out and you don't hold judgment and you just lay out the facts Right, then it becomes apparent to the receiver of that information oh, this was the fact and I need to do X to change that fact.

Roxi: 20:10

One of the hardest things leaders have to get their head around is how to give constructive feedback. It prevents a lot of conflicts and it prevents a lot of problems, and it's never about judgment. It's never about judgment. It's, first of all, you have a right as a leader to see something that's not going well qualitatively or quantitatively and to bring that to the attention of the person. You have that right and, by the way, you have that responsibility, right, right. But the first question I ask people to ask themselves is what's their motivation? What's their motivation? Is their motivation to punish? Well then, that's not constructive feedback. Is their motivation to judge? Well, that's not constructive feedback. Is their motivation to improve the situation? Well then, that can be constructive feedback. To improve the situation? Well then, that can be constructive feedback.

Roxi: 21:11

So, for instance, besides preparing, which is the first step, the second step in constructive feedback is the one that catches everybody and it's the one that is the magic bullet. So it's called convey positive intent. So if Laura say you are late for work three times this week and I'm your boss, uh-oh, what I would want to say to you, right is Laura, I really want you to be successful here and it's important to me that I understand what's going on with you, what I've noticed so now we go to observation what I've noticed is that three times this week you've been late and the impact of that is so-and-so and so-and-so and so-and-so have had to step in to take care of that. And you know, over time that will create some resentment and I wouldn't want that for you. So, and then I'm going to ask for a response. So I talk about the observation, I talk about the impact, ask for a response and I say you know, can you tell me what's going on?

Laura : 22:22

Okay, well, and I I hate to stop us because I know it's a perfect, perfect way to explain the expectations. You were saying that if you set up those expectations to begin with, that would work, but we are out of time, sadly.

Roxi: 22:38

I could talk all day.

Laura : 22:39

Yeah, I know you and I. It's just great, but I love the fact that you provide such rich information, so thank you so much for this. I really want to thank you for coming on the show. It's just. I really feel like we need to have a second one of these to follow up. So, yeah, but thank you for being on the show. It's just been fantastic. Roxy, if people want to reach you, how can they get in touch with you?

Roxi: 23:06

Well, go to my website highlandconsultinggroupinccom and you can get my books there. I'm not sure my book is on Amazon anymore. It was on Barnes Noble, but if you want the Leading, like it Matters book, but if you want it, I've got it so you can always get in touch with me. And then you know, the my higher rate fire rate book is everywhere. So help yourself. I, if I could give it to everybody, I would I know, I know it's such a good one.

Laura : 23:37

Well, thank you so much, Roxy. It's been great to have you on the show.

Roxi: 23:41

Thank you, appreciate it, appreciate what you do.

Laura : 23:44

Oh, thanks, and I want to thank you for listening to the Mosaic Life with Laura W. I want you to listen to this episode or other episodes by our great hosts, and go to bizradious and click on shows. Thanks so much for listening. Have a great rest of your day.